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Post by addicted2wx - Villa Ridge, Mo on Jan 13, 2019 22:55:52 GMT -6
Why do the reported measurements on the right side have Union at 10.5" but the map has them at 9.5"? Wouldn’t doubt if a later report came in after they made that map. Quite possible Union had 10.5” on the west side and 9.5” on the east side or more north than south. Pretty much if you take 47 from Union to Marthasville just across the river there’s almost a 4” spread in that short distance. |
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Post by mmarkillie82 on Jan 13, 2019 22:55:59 GMT -6
Why do the reported measurements on the right side have Union at 10.5" but the map has them at 9.5"? There could be a spot with more... But generally the area could be lower. Anyone know what Spirit ended with? Liquid and total snow? |
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Post by bdgwx on Jan 13, 2019 22:56:08 GMT -6
So Angela H just said there was a 17” report of snow in Washington, MO. I’ve measured there and a lot the past couple of days from New Haven to Gray Summit and have not found a total over 13.5”. And that 12” line only is about 5 miles to the south of the Missouri River. Would anybody have the location this was measured at by chance? It was in downtown Washington. The source is a co-op observer. Seems kinda high doesn't it? |
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Post by addicted2wx - Villa Ridge, Mo on Jan 13, 2019 22:59:20 GMT -6
Well I can tell you I was there and that’s not what I measured. They were actually between 11 and 12.5”. I wish the NWS made these people provide proof with pic because it causes skewed data. Must have been in a field with 5” of grass underneath.
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Post by dmbstl on Jan 13, 2019 23:01:32 GMT -6
Sounds like I am in the minority regarding MODOT. I don't know maybe I was crabby from a brutal travel schedule and rushing to get out of Pittsburgh on Friday. I landed at Lambert at 1pm and it was hardly snowing. BY 2PM I was dead in the water. It seemed odd with the tmperature barely below freezing. Eventually, took the backroads and after 3-4 failed routes made it home by 6. Luckier than most for sure, but exhausted. Didn't seem like there was any pretreatment, but I don't know. Employers letting everyone go at the same time certainly adds to the problem and absolutely impossible to clear when cars stack up. I told our staff to leave when they felt it was appropiate. CEO wasn't happy, but I explained we have so few big snow threats that it makes no sense to but anyone in danger. It is not like they are going to get any work done if they are stressed about winter weather. He came around. Usually, I have trouble with two treacherous turns by my house, but honestly the roads were in much better shape in the boonies and that is usually not the case. Plus not everyone can leave work early. Lots of people have work situations that aren't flexible and/or bosses that aren't reasonable. |
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modracer
Weather Intern
MASCOUTAH, Illinois
Posts: 836
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Post by modracer on Jan 13, 2019 23:06:26 GMT -6
Did you guys also notice that this snow had a blue hue/tint to it? I brought it up yesterday, but only one other person said they had noticed Did you guys hear 16" of snow fell in Florida? Florida, MO... Some crazy totals with this storm! This ranks with 2006 and the Groundhog Day storm...both 15"+ in spots...and of course the Palm Sunday storm. Yup...all monsters...but different Dynaimcally... this storm was nothing like Palm Sunday... but in terms of amounts and types of snow...it was exactly like the Palm Sunday storm. This was one of the strangest events I have ever seen. |
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Post by dmbstl on Jan 13, 2019 23:07:10 GMT -6
Road crews can't keep up with 1-2"/hr snow rates with no traffic...let alone rush hour. There's absolutely no basis for blame on road crews in that worst case scenario. It doesn't help that modern interstates are basically rolling 4 lane warehouses. With just-in-time delivery and other similar processes there are so many 18 wheelers on the road that when the weather goes south, those vehicles become liabilities when it comes chokepoints. (I'm not faulting the hardworking truckers.) |
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Post by Snowman99 on Jan 13, 2019 23:13:15 GMT -6
I had about 11" at my house, and no way did Washington get anywhere close to 17.
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Post by jmg378s on Jan 13, 2019 23:13:51 GMT -6
UKMET has a very robust storm next weekend with a closed low at 500mb and a ~990mb surface low moving right over STL. No insight as to what it does with temperatures, but it's hard for me to imagine that specific scenario producing much frozen or freezing precip.
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Post by landscaper on Jan 13, 2019 23:24:15 GMT -6
I disagree on MODot pre treating Friday, they had pretreatment of liquids down on all lanes before the storm started. Chemicals will only control the first 1/2” or so, then they loose their effectiveness. With 1” or greater snow rates they were basically ineffective within about an hour. Then a mass exodus of cars hits the road as there starting to plow, and it’s a recipe for disaster. Within a few hours you had full roadways, thousands of cars they can’t move in snow (rear wheel drive many bad front wheel drive) I once you start getting a few cars or trucks that can’t make it up the smallest hill it starts a chain reaction. Then you have a lot of cars stuck not moving and guess where all the plows are , they are stuck sitting in traffic behind hundreds of cars.
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Post by unclesam6 on Jan 13, 2019 23:27:49 GMT -6
Did you guys also notice that this snow had a blue hue/tint to it? I brought it up yesterday, but only one other person said they had noticed Yup...all monsters...but different Dynaimcally... this storm was nothing like Palm Sunday... but in terms of amounts and types of snow...it was exactly like the Palm Sunday storm. This was one of the strangest events I have ever seen. Yep. I noticed it too. I would assume it has something to do with the amount of water in the snow... water has a low albedo so it tends to take in more light... mix that with snow and you're getting the blue-ish glow. |
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Post by stlweatherguy - Hillsboro, MO on Jan 13, 2019 23:28:44 GMT -6
I saw they said 11.2 inches in Desoto, MO...just next door to me. What did the folks on the forum measure there?
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Post by Frivolousz21 on Jan 13, 2019 23:30:03 GMT -6
UKMET has a very robust storm next weekend with a closed low at 500mb and a ~990mb surface low moving right over STL. No insight as to what it does with temperatures, but it's hard for me to imagine that specific scenario producing much frozen or freezing precip. Nope. The ,00z models were all over. The GFS - snow storm Fv3 mostly rain to cold Icon - smoking cirrus Ggem - rain, mix, snow We need the Thursday storm to be strong like the GFS shows. |
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Post by guyatacomputer - NE St. Peters on Jan 13, 2019 23:38:33 GMT -6
Really, the impact from this weekend's storm was limited to just the snow. Temperatures were not...and still are not...all that cold and ice/freezing rain was not a big factor. The next system has the potential to bring everything including the kitchen sink… and will be followed by dangerous cold. Ice and wind always makes me think “power outages.“ If there is even moderate cold at the end that is a recipe for some really bad times. |
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Post by Snowman99 on Jan 13, 2019 23:46:12 GMT -6
I think the models are going to have a much more difficult time nailing next weekend down, then with this past storm. Lots of players on the table.
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Post by guyatacomputer - NE St. Peters on Jan 13, 2019 23:52:32 GMT -6
In 82- they dumped into the Mississippi I think the EPA has banned that now. 6Boston used to dump the snow in the bay but the EPA made them stop that practice. 6 or 8 years ago, when they had several monster storms in a row, they trucked the snow to no longer used parking lot somewhere and made a giant mountain. It was still several feet high in mid-summer. You can probably Google it and find the story |
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Post by guyatacomputer - NE St. Peters on Jan 13, 2019 23:57:00 GMT -6
Road crews can't keep up with 1-2"/hr snow rates with no traffic...let alone rush hour. There's absolutely no basis for blame on road crews in that worst case scenario. At least not around here. We just don't have the equipment or the manpower. If this was upstate New York or Western Michigan it would be different. |
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Post by guyatacomputer - NE St. Peters on Jan 14, 2019 0:07:39 GMT -6
Road crews can't keep up with 1-2"/hr snow rates with no traffic...let alone rush hour. There's absolutely no basis for blame on road crews in that worst case scenario. It doesn't help that modern interstates are basically rolling 4 lane warehouses. With just-in-time delivery and other similar processes there are so many 18 wheelers on the road that when the weather goes south, those vehicles become liabilities when it comes chokepoints. (I'm not faulting the hardworking truckers.) The same is also true with MoDOT plow trucks. Used to be theyhad blades about the width of !2' lane. Now. In an effort to be the most effective with the labor they have the plow units are 2 lanes wide. It's fine unit it needs to be maneuvered in traffic that is barely moving. |
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Post by guyatacomputer - NE St. Peters on Jan 14, 2019 0:10:27 GMT -6
Did you guys also notice that this snow had a blue hue/tint to it? I brought it up yesterday, but only one other person said they had noticed Yep. I noticed it too. I would assume it has something to do with the amount of water in the snow... water has a low albedo so it tends to take in more light... mix that with snow and you're getting the blue-ish glow. Glaciers have that same blue color because of the water content and their density. |
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Post by Frivolousz21 on Jan 14, 2019 0:32:33 GMT -6
Euro?
Must be meh
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Post by demerson- Fletcher MO on Jan 14, 2019 0:34:23 GMT -6
Well we have been living in Dittmer this last year. About 10 miles west of DeSoto. I can tell you we had no more than 8 inches with this storm.
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Post by Snowstorm920 on Jan 14, 2019 0:37:28 GMT -6
quite the opposite
starts as some rain
then an ice storm with crashing temps
then it looks like the system blows up and drops a foot of snow in the metro with blizzard conditions
very interesting run
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Post by unclesam6 on Jan 14, 2019 0:38:14 GMT -6
Euro holding strong. Fairly significant icing followed by several hours of heavy snow.
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Post by Snowman99 on Jan 14, 2019 0:40:59 GMT -6
Euro would be uh,,fascinating
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Post by Snowstorm920 on Jan 14, 2019 0:43:44 GMT -6
Euro would be uh,,fascinating its just....odd looking. Like you said its a really complex setup. Lots of moving parts and different vorticity lobes interacting and moving about
One thing that looks like a certainty is its going to be very cold and windy on the backside of this system
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Post by birdsonthebat (MO'Fallon) on Jan 14, 2019 1:01:46 GMT -6
If we are going to talk about MODOT and their shortfalls.....then we should probably talk about Missouri drivers and their issues with lack of experience driving in the snow.
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Post by Sparkman - Wildwood, Mo on Jan 14, 2019 1:02:20 GMT -6
Don’t bet against the Euro.
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Post by Snowstorm920 on Jan 14, 2019 1:03:04 GMT -6
The euro is super juicy to. PW values in the area are crazy high.
1”+ along and S of 44 at the height of the storm
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Post by Snowman99 on Jan 14, 2019 1:13:05 GMT -6
Euro has over .25 of ice..over 6 inches of snow, blizzard conditions. Temps stay in the single digits next Sunday, get down to the minus teens Sunday night with wind chills around -30. 850 temps drop to near -20. Now, that's winter.
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Post by amstilost on Jan 14, 2019 1:22:37 GMT -6
I reported in here 9.25" in De soto. My measurements were not "officially' taken. The duration of the storm coupled with the rain on Saturday made it difficult. I know bororug reported more with the def band that plowed through Saturday night, but he is three or four miles away from me. I heard Angela Hutti mention Potosi received 3.5" from that on Saturday night. He has to be real close or at 11" based on that. I also had a lot of snow that didn't "stick".
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